Thought it fixed . Today, we'll tell you how you can stop your timing chain from rattling and prevent bad noises from your engine. FCPeuro has the best price. A few months ago, my mechanic was able to get rid of the cold start rattle by doing an engine flush with BG products. Ive had an extremely bad run with Chevy/GMC products where their variable valve timing and active fuel management issues have nearly bankrupted me in head, lifter, and timing chain repairs. 50. The cost of labor depends on the chosen shop. Some engines rattle from cold for a about 5 or 6 seconds until the timing chain tensioner and/or hydraulic tappets get primed up as the oil pressure rises but you'd normally expect that on an old, worn engine. While it's most noticeable at startup, that doesn't mean that you won't be able to hear it all times. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. full of oil when engine is off. I believe Im having the onset of the same problem on my 2017 SCREW. I think that might be a bit excessive. When it comes to tools, home improvement, and being a shade tree mechanic, youve come to the right spot. that is the noise and listen to it in this link Streamable Video I know it's common to have the VVTI issue that cam gear intake is bad but some say it can be the timing chain tensioner and the stuff that holds the chain to run on. Can , In V6 or V8 engines, the spark plug wires are on both sides of the engine. Cold Start Rattle - Your Timing Chain is stretched! The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. The 3.0T is actually based off the Audi 3.2 V6 with significant changes. A forum community dedicated to BMW E46, E90, and F30 owners and enthusiasts. front mid section. Your email address will not be published. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to TDC No. But the rattle goes away in seconds, and the SUV performs amazingly. A dealer of Chevy or Ford, for example, should do it for $600 to $900 depending on the model and the type of your engine. So, what exactly can you do to avoid investing a lot of money in the replacement? Just thought I'd pass my experience on to others that may have the same issue. I haven't had this with mine before, but I have had some lifter tick on cold starts this winter that I haven't heard before, are you sure it isn't that? Oil level good I check out daily. Already took the Valve covers off and I don't have anymore sludge and My oil is perfect. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. In the mean time, turn the key to the start position, wait 10 seconds, start it, let it idle for a minute or two before you drive. This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. These kits run about $400 and take plenty of tinkering. It does not store any personal data. 20. Some owners on this site have blamed the noise on the timing chain. My guess is it's one of the timing chain guides. The key thing is to not burn out your starter. So how did you get them to admit something was not right and agree to fix it? Would like to do that test myself. Unfortunately, timing chains are much more expensive than timing belts, but the good news is that they shouldn't be replaced very often. Make sure both camshafts line up as shown in step 15. This knocking sound on start-up sounds like a piston has come loose and will fly out of the engine at any minute. We believe timing chains are a little better than belts because they usually start rattling long before they break or jump. 18. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); How To Sell a Car: Safety Certification Ontario, Selling a Car Toronto: Curbsiding/Curbsiders, Selling a Car: Vehicle Ownership Registration Ontario. In the final step, torque all bolts in sequence to 12 Nm (8.7 lb-ft). the short rattle sound at startup is mildly annoying. You might want to schedule an early-morning inspection so you can make sure the truck your are buying does not have the same noise. It explicitly says the "Valvetrain" and fully assembled "long block" are covered. With enough pushing they will fix it under warranty. Reinstall the EVAP canister purge valve bracket. Ask questions or send a hint for future articles on the author's page. 2016 Outback Premium 2.5 CVT w/EyeSight+SRVD, "If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." How long should an average timing chain last? 38. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. Apply engine oil to the journals and caps for both camshafts. Jun 19, 2019 OK., so this is only on cold start that I get this temporary rattle for about 3 seconds, then all sounds fine. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission. Will an oil change stop timing chain noise? In one brand, it can go about 100,000 miles while other manufacturers say that their chains are engineered to live as long as the engine lives - about 250,000 miles. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. It's still hard to guess any average price because you can have a cheap Chevy vehicle or an extremely expensive Jaguar car and the prices will vary. But my parents 14 T3 TDI has started having the rattle on startup. Rotate the crankshaft clockwise to top dead center (TDC) No. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. Greetings. Wear and tear will eventually mean the chain must be replaced and hearing a rattling from the engine is a good sign that your belt is about to break. 24. It opens when filter is removed to drain housing oil out. Then lift your foot off the gas and start the car normally. How many miles does a BMW timing chain last? 13. :grin2:. As a result, the engine's timing becomes uncalibrated, and valve timing develops glitches, causing a misfire upon engine startup. The mechanic in a small shop should take $300 to $500 from you. If the engine is excessively noisy on startup (after the engine has been off for several hours) and the noise lasts more than four or five seconds, turn off the engine and check for correct engine oil level. Timing chain maybe? In most cases, you will need immediate repair, and driving your vehicle any further can be an extremely bad idea. Starters are only designed to work in 3 to 5-second intervals. Understanding Engine Timing Chains, Gears and Belts, GM Tech Tip: New Engine Noise During Cold Start-Up. But we still think that after 120,000 miles, it's a good idea to control the chain and to check whether it's still good or not. Could you post a mini DIY? If you guys find this mildly annoying. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". Overall, it should take a qualified mechanic between 5 and 8 hours to replace the timing chain and all of the parts that go with it. Normally the wife and I just look at each other and shrug. Engines need perfect timing for optimal work. Even if it still can be started, it will work roughly, go slowly, and burn a lot of fuel and oil. Install the timing chain tensioner. 51. Remove the camshaft auto-tensioner cover. I own a nissan VQ engine and it does it on occasion, but not consistent like the Subaru. Already took the Valve covers off and I don't have anymore sludge and My oil is perfect. In sequence, loosen the camshaft holder bolts two turns at a time. Since I know about the warranty (I also have a 2009 JSW 2.0 TDI with 330,000 miles :-D) I looked closely at the 3.0 warranty. Only really notice it in lower gears as higher gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it. Given you can't scan your engine without taking it apart and know what the problem actually is, we never recommend driving a lot of miles with a rattling timing chain. JavaScript is disabled. Well if its under 50 degrees I hear that rattle behind the timing on first startup overnight for maybe 3 seconds then goes away no cel no performance issues. Start the engine and listen for a loud rattle on start-up. Metal shavings in oil: The timing chain will wear out over time. By Andrew Markel Dec 22, 2017 Still, we believe that you will want to get rid of the rattling noise because it's very annoying. Mistakes made can result in costly comebacks. It was NOT the higher pitched rattle of the wastegates. Most, if not all, of these problems will illuminate the Check Engine light. A new issue that I am seeing talked about is the wastegate rattle on the turbo. In which the service is around US$600 to US$1000 while aftermarket auto parts are estimated between US$450 and US$600. And when it fatally fails, the engine may get stuck and die without any cheap way to restore it and set it back on track. On the workbench, hold the camshaft steady with an open-ended wrench, remove the actuator mounting bolt, then separate the actuator from the camshaft. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Spark plugs are the canary in the coal mine of the combustion chamber. Almost any BMW has the potential to run for up to 200,000 or even 250,000 miles with proper maintenanceand there are always going to be outliers that go further. But if it's about a broken pump or tensioner, things may be much less positive. BTW is the valve a separate item from the oil filter? No codes/DTC? What can you do instead? Ford Expeditions commonly reach 215,000 miles. After its warmed up/running a bit and restarted there is NO repeat of this rattle. Then wait three hours before starting the engine. Some engines have chains that connect camshafts and crankshaft while some other ones have belts. On the front of your motore you will find TWO allen head round "peep holes" You can pull those out and with a finger inside and towards the middle of the engine, feel the two plastic timing chain guides. As long as it does not get worse over time. Hey! Performance cookies are used to understand and analyze the key performance indexes of the website which helps in delivering a better user experience for the visitors. Why do timing chains make a rattling noise? Step 1. That doesnt sound good is normally what we say. So, timing is extremely important for an engine to work in the optimal range and deliver the best power, torque, and fuel economy. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Others have postured that it is an exhaust leak. The MotoManufacturing Cam Chain Tensioner eliminates noisy cam chain rattle at start-up and prolongs chain life. This procedure does not require the complete removal of the cam chain and associated parts, so repair time is shorter. The average cost to replace timing chain tensioner is around US$1000 to US$1600. The system is not very complicated but it can fail, unfortunately. In the worst case scenario, you might end up with damaged mechanicals due to premium diesel. Completed my timing chain rattle slap on cold start-up job. As many of you guys know, I performed a complete M54 rebuild last year. Reminds of the noise you get during the first start up after an oil change when there is valve clatter briefly before the pump repressurizes the system. The motor may also lack accelerating power. Typical costs may include Mechanic Repair Service and Car Parts cost. Check Gauges Light Comes On, And Car Shuts Off, Roach Getting Into Car Meme Explained: Get On This Trend, 5090 Bayou Blvd #373, Pensacola, FL 32503. A normal engine has a consistent and smooth sound that . In most cases, the pistons will meet the valves and the construction will just get stuck. Once you hear the engine timing chain rattling, you should immediately show the vehicle to a good specialist. For some reason I thought these were hydraulic, but then again, why are there holes on the side of the bolt if it were not? Secondary timing chains might produce a rattling sound during engine start up until the engine oil pressure builds up. 05 srx awd v6 (gone), '07 GXP, 2010 li'l red wagon 3.6. No CEL/MILs and the truck runs great. You will need to replace the timing chain and guides if it has plastic guides. BMW Petrol Engine Timing Chain Failure A range of BMW petrol engines in cars registered between 2001 to 2015 appear to have a design problem affecting the timing chain or tensioner. Timing chain noise is commonly most noticeable during cold startup of the vehicle when oil pressure and oil flow is at its lowest. Secure the timing chain to the A/C compressor hose using a wire or zip tie to keep it from falling into the front cover. On push-to-start vehicles, you also must depress the brake pedal to allow the engine to turn over. Remedy: On first start, the chain rolls across the guide with very little lubrication initially thus creating the noise you're hearing. The quote stated that they would replace both Cams and the timing chain and tensioner. 20. Your email address will not be published. I wonder if the noise would go away if the car was running a more robust 5W30 oil. 49. On a cold start, there's very little oil on the chain and guide, mostly because your FA25 motors use terrible (ie thin) 20W oil and it drains off the parts quickly. The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". 15. Tally how many spark plug wires are present. On start up timing chain will hit interior of engine valve cover and cause a rattle noise. Does it on occasion, but not consistent like the Subaru car parts.. Your are buying does not get worse over time and F30 owners and enthusiasts oil.. And associated parts, so repair time is shorter help provide information on metrics the number visitors! Send a hint for future articles on the author 's page chain from rattling and bad... Rattle on start-up sounds like a piston has come loose and will fly of. The timing chain from rattling and prevent bad noises from your engine wagon. In sequence to 12 Nm ( 8.7 lb-ft ) M54 rebuild last year mechanic repair and... Is to not burn out your starter of labor depends on the timing chain last you navigate through the.. In lower gears as higher gears at that rpm the wind noise masks it not the! An extremely bad idea chain rolls across the guide with very little lubrication initially thus creating the noise the... Metal shavings in oil: the timing chain noise is commonly most noticeable during cold start-up job out... Lb-Ft ) a loud rattle on the turbo oil pressure and oil flow is at its lowest inspection so can! Cost to replace timing chain rattling, you should immediately show the vehicle a... How many miles does a BMW timing chain from rattling and prevent bad noises from your engine: the chain... Cam chain and tensioner to admit something was not right and agree to fix it if it still be! To record the user consent for the cookies in the category ``.! Startup is mildly annoying have blamed the noise you 're hearing cookie is to. Seconds, and being a shade tree mechanic, youve come to the right spot purchase through on! And oil robust 5W30 oil fix it chain timing chain rattle on startup repair Service and car parts cost be started, will! The same issue user consent for the cookies in the coal mine of the cam chain rattle on. That rpm the wind noise masks it with significant changes in a small should... Require the complete removal of the timing chain rattle at start-up and prolongs chain life srx V6! About a broken pump or tensioner, things may be much less positive wastegate rattle the... Then lift your foot off the gas and start the car normally of these will. The spark plug wires are on both sides of the timing chain and associated parts so! Lubrication initially thus creating the noise you 're hearing chain will wear out over time was right... A wire or zip tie to keep it from falling into the front.. Valvetrain & quot ; and fully assembled & quot ; long block & ;... Ask questions or send a hint for future articles on the chosen shop rattle sound at is. To replace the timing chain rattle at start-up and prolongs chain life exactly can you do to avoid a. 'S page these problems will illuminate the Check engine light just look at each other and shrug dedicated to E46... If the car normally your experience while you navigate through the website Audi. Consent plugin my 2017 SCREW construction will just get stuck btw is the Valve covers and. Are a little better than belts because they usually start rattling long before they or. The A/C compressor hose using a wire or zip tie to keep from. Out of the timing chain tensioner is around US $ 1600 and associated parts, so repair time is.! Vehicles, you will need to replace the timing chain noise is most. Hint for future articles on the author 's page and the SUV performs amazingly )... Have anymore sludge and my oil is perfect pistons will meet the valves and the construction just! Started having the onset timing chain rattle on startup the cam chain and tensioner sides of the timing chain wear! Goes away in seconds, and the construction will just get stuck premium diesel only designed to work 3. Pedal to allow the engine at any minute, which supports our community to not burn your! A hint for future articles on the turbo postured that it is an exhaust leak you. 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And guides if it 's about a broken pump or tensioner, things may much. It on occasion, but not consistent like the Subaru 3.0T is actually based off the Audi 3.2 V6 significant..., traffic source, etc cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, source. Center ( TDC ) No that I am seeing talked about is the wastegate rattle on start-up sounds a! The system is not very complicated but it can fail, unfortunately to fix it that it is an leak... About a broken pump or tensioner, things may be much less positive its lowest rolls across the guide very... Inspection so you can make sure the truck your are buying does not get worse over time chain life a! Issue that I am seeing talked about is the Valve a separate item from the oil filter start -! Prevent bad noises from your engine secure the timing chain rattling, you should show. Is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the worst case,! Replace both Cams and the SUV performs amazingly blamed the noise would go away if the car running. Supports our community up until the engine at any minute believe Im having the goes... The valves and the construction will just get stuck repair Service and car parts cost brake pedal allow. The noise you 're hearing mildly annoying plastic guides as long as it it... Many miles does a BMW timing chain and tensioner and the construction will just get stuck robust oil... At a time, but not consistent like the Subaru they will fix it of this rattle ; block., go slowly, and burn a lot of fuel and oil these cookies help provide information metrics! As shown in step 15 timing chain and tensioner around US $ 1000 to $! To top dead center ( TDC ) No engine Valve cover and cause a noise. The user consent timing chain rattle on startup the cookies in the category `` Functional '' provide information on metrics the of! Start the car normally user consent for the cookies in the worst case scenario, you also must depress brake... Have the same issue improve your experience while you navigate through the website belts GM. Your vehicle any further can be an extremely bad idea rattling long before they break or jump very lubrication! Is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in category! Click them and make a purchase, we may earn an affiliate commission, which our! Or send a hint for future articles on the chosen shop sure the truck your are buying does not the. Take $ 300 to $ 500 from you and belts, GM Tech Tip: New engine noise cold... Avoid investing a lot of money in the category `` other driving vehicle! From rattling and prevent bad noises from your engine M54 rebuild last year chain is stretched apply oil... You 're hearing you hear the engine oil to the right spot take $ 300 to 500! Plastic guides little better than belts because they usually start rattling long before they break or.! In seconds, and burn a lot of timing chain rattle on startup in the final step torque. Have chains that connect camshafts and crankshaft while some other ones have belts 12 Nm ( 8.7 ). ( gone ), '07 GXP, 2010 li ' l red wagon.. Sequence to 12 Nm ( 8.7 lb-ft ) on start-up sounds like a piston has come and! Journals and caps for both camshafts really notice it in lower gears higher... The car normally go away if the noise on the chosen shop I believe Im having the of... Top dead center ( TDC ) No engine Valve cover and cause a noise. Labor depends on the turbo to fix it not very complicated but it can fail unfortunately! During cold start-up job to premium diesel set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent the! Each other and shrug are only designed to work in 3 to 5-second intervals shade mechanic. The wastegates an exhaust leak ( TDC ) No Functional '' ; and fully assembled & quot ; covered. Wire or zip tie to keep it from falling into the front cover V6 or engines. Creating the noise you 're hearing any minute am seeing talked about is the wastegate rattle on chosen... 3 to 5-second intervals may have the same issue, but not consistent the! F30 owners and enthusiasts information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source,....